American English

[Loki]

I was talking with a friend of mine (quite proficient in English) some days ago, and he told me he was reading a book written by an American author; he said that it was so difficult to read.
So I am wondering: is American English difficult to understand to the British as well? If you have any, what kind of problems have you got?

Now, a question for the Americans too. I happened to visit this website:
Urban Dictionary, January 21: muffin top. I found some rather weird words, such as santaclaustrophobia. The question is: do you really use this kind of words?!

[lenz]

That kind of inspired word invention goes on all the time, as I'm sure it does in most languages. If the word is seen or heard on the internet or TV and catches on, and is used often enough, it can earn a place in dictionaries. Usually, such a neologism gets used so much within a short time everyone gets sick of it and it's allowed to die out. Anyone who has done Christmas shopping in a mall knows what santaclaustrophobia means.

[Loki]

Speaking of differences between British and American English, I wanted to know from British and American English native speakers how do you pronounce the word schedule. Several sources (dictionaries, films...) that the Birtish English pronunciation should be /'ʃedju:l/ and American English pronunciation should be /'skedju:l/. However, my esteemed English teacher claims it is the other way round. What do you say?

[hdw]

Speaking of differences between British and American English, I wanted to know from British and American English native speakers how do you pronounce the word schedule. Several sources (dictionaries, films...) that the Birtish English pronunciation should be /'ʃedju:l/ and American English pronunciation should be /'skedju:l/. However, my esteemed English teacher claims it is the other way round. What do you say?

I'm a Brit and I say shed-, but I wouldn't like to claim that there is a hard and fast division between Brits and Americans on this. I'm sure there must be Brits who say sked-.

Modern English is very fluid and there are lots of alternative ways of pronouncing and stressing words: e.g. data can be DAHTA or DAYTA, controversy can be CONtroversy or ConTROversy, kilometre can be KILometre or KilOmetre, and I could probably think of other examples but it's lunchtime so I'm heading downstairs to the kitchen now.

Harry

[miercuri]

I remember there was a British dictionary which showed which variant was prefered, in percentages. I always pick the more widespread one.

[lenz]

Speaking of differences between British and American English, I wanted to know from British and American English native speakers how do you pronounce the word schedule. Several sources (dictionaries, films...) that the Birtish English pronunciation should be /'ʃedju:l/ and American English pronunciation should be /'skedju:l/. However, my esteemed English teacher claims it is the other way round. What do you say?

An old joke is that it depends on which shool (school) you went to.

[lionel]

An old joke is that it depends on which shool (school) you went to.

Oh, that's wicked.

[Bottle Rocket]

Oh, that's wicked.

Of course, if it's a real shul your timetable (/'ʃedju:l/ or /'skedju:l/ alike) will have to accommodate an entirely other calendar altogether


LvT

[Loki]

An old joke is that it depends on which shool (school) you went to.

I have not got it. Could someone help me with it?

[lenz]

Quote:
Originally Posted by lenz
An old joke is that it depends on which shool (school) you went to.


I have not got it. Could someone help me with it?

If you can pronounce schedule shedule or skedule (it's pronounced both ways), you should be able to say shool or skool for school (it's only skool). Of course English spelling and pronunciation doesn't always make sense.

[hdw]

I don't think Brits and Americans have much trouble with each others' written English. There are differences of idiom, and even grammatical differences, but you get used to them. Americans seem to favour (or favor) strong verb past tense forms that in English would be weak, e.g.

Amer. present tense "fit" past tense "fit"
British present tense "fit" past tense "fitted"

Amer. present tense "dive" past tense "dove"
British present tense "dive" past tense "dived"

and there are lots of lexical (vocabulary) items like Amer.sidewalk/Brit. pavement, etc., but you grow up knowing these things. I would say that the Brits. take more influence from the Americans language-wise than vice versa. As for spelling, American spelling (e.g. -or instead of -our) was regularised (or regularized) by Noah Webster's magisterial dictionary.

As regards the spoken language, the Americans often have trouble understanding anything that's not the Queen's English, i.e. our many regional dialects. When a feature film was made about the Beatles, the Liverpool accents had to be toned down for the American market, and John Lennon was apparently scornful of the word "ciggies" being used for cigarettes. The northern lads would have said "fags", but when you think what "fags" means in America, and what people tend to do with cigarettes, maybe "ciggies" was a good compromise.

Likewise, "knickers" and "pants" are a bit more raunchy in Britain than they are in the States.

From the influence of Hollywood movies and American TV, and more recently tourism to the States, Brits are perhaps more acclimatised to spoken American than Americans are to spoken British English. I heard once that only about 10% of Americans have a passport, so not really all that many come over here, and I don't think their media are swamped with British imports.

Harry

[miercuri]

I always wondered if American editions of British books apply the American spelling regulations to the text, or vice-versa? I assume they leave the text as it is, right?

[Omo]

What about spelling in Canada, Australia, NZ? Do they have their own local mixtures of spelling or do they keep to AE (Canada?) resp. BE (Aus, NZ?)?

I'm always very confused about double negations in English (I don't know whether this is something exclusive to American English or also common in British dialects?). I'm talking about phrases like "ain't no", "don't know nothing" etc. Once I tried to read M. Twain's Huckleberry Finn and couldn't get into it, because the text was full of such double negations and I never knew whether they meant what they said or the opposite.

[hdw]

I think the Aussies and Kiwis follow British spelling conventions. I'm not sure about the Canadians, but we have some on this forum who can tell you.

Double negation is a common feature in regional English speech and is just a way of emphasizing the negation. "I ain't got no money" just means 'I have no money'. Old-fashioned teachers used to claim that two negatives make a positive, so "I ain't got no ..." must mean 'I have some ...', but that is rubbish, as the rules of mathematics don't apply to natural languages.

As proof of that, in the Slavonic languages it's normal to use double negatives. For example, nikdo ne?el do divadla, 'no-one went to the theatre', lit. 'no-one didn't go to the theatre'. Or, nepotřebuji nic, 'I don't need anything', lit. 'I don't need nothing'.

Even triple negation occurs in Czech, e.g. Nikdy nikde nikomu nic nekupuju, 'I never buy anything for anyone anywhere', which literally translated is 'I don't never buy nothing for nobody nowhere'.

I'm sure some of our chums on the forum could quote similar examples from Russian.

Harry

[miercuri]

As proof of that, in the Slavonic languages it's normal to use double negatives. For example, nikdo nešel do divadla, 'no-one went to the theatre', lit. 'no-one didn't go to the theatre'. Or, nepotřebuji nic, 'I don't need anything', lit. 'I don't need nothing'.

Even triple negation occurs in Czech, e.g. Nikdy nikde nikomu nic nekupuju, 'I never buy anything for anyone anywhere', which literally translated is 'I don't never buy nothing for nobody nowhere'.

I'm sure some of our chums on the forum could quote similar examples from Russian.

Double (and occasional triple) negations are the norm in Romanian as well. I don't know whether this is the Slavic influence or not, it might be a trait shared by more Romance language. If I am not mistaking the Spanish for 'I have no idea' is no tengo ninguna idea. I know for sure that in French double negation is impossible, but I don't know anything about its use in Italian or Portuguese. I'd be grateful if someone cleared it up for me.

[Omo]

[...]Double negation is a common feature in regional English speech and is just a way of emphasizing the negation. "I ain't got no money" just means 'I have no money'.

I know what it means, it's just that I always stumble when I see it, because it isn't used in standard English?

Old-fashioned teachers used to claim that two negatives make a positive, so "I ain't got no ..." must mean 'I have some ...', but that is rubbish, as the rules of mathematics don't apply to natural languages.

Well, this is how it is in German, so this seems natural and right to me.

As proof of that, in the Slavonic languages it's normal to use double negatives. For example, nikdo nešel do divadla, 'no-one went to the theatre', lit. 'no-one didn't go to the theatre'. Or, nepotřebuji nic, 'I don't need anything', lit. 'I don't need nothing'.[...]

I know. "Nikto ne snajet", nobody not knows, means "nobody knows" of course. But in Slavic languages double negations are consistently used. What is confusing is the switch in English. It doesn't seem do be used in standardised, formal English, or is it?

[learna]

I think the Aussies and Kiwis follow British spelling conventions. I'm not sure about the Canadians, but we have some on this forum who can tell you.

Double negation is a common feature in regional English speech and is just a way of emphasizing the negation. "I ain't got no money" just means 'I have no money'. Old-fashioned teachers used to claim that two negatives make a positive, so "I ain't got no ..." must mean 'I have some ...', but that is rubbish, as the rules of mathematics don't apply to natural languages.

As proof of that, in the Slavonic languages it's normal to use double negatives. For example, nikdo nešel do divadla, 'no-one went to the theatre', lit. 'no-one didn't go to the theatre'. Or, nepotřebuji nic, 'I don't need anything', lit. 'I don't need nothing'.

Even triple negation occurs in Czech, e.g. Nikdy nikde nikomu nic nekupuju, 'I never buy anything for anyone anywhere', which literally translated is 'I don't never buy nothing for nobody nowhere'.

I'm sure some of our chums on the forum could quote similar examples from Russian.

Harry

Harry, that is true, in Russian it is normal to use several negatives. I think, this is an interesting example:
"Я никогда никому не обещал ничего невозможного" - "I have never not promised nobody nothing impossible."
And there is a nice popular quotation:"Никогда не говори никогда" - "Never do not say "never"" or if we translate it more accuratelly - "Never say "never"."

[Liam]

What about spelling in Canada, Australia, NZ? Do they have their own local mixtures of spelling or do they keep to AE (Canada?) resp. BE (Aus, NZ?)?

Former British colonies all follow the modern British spelling system. There is some variation between Canada and Australia (colonize vs. colonise), but words like colour, etc, are spelled with a U. And spectre is spectre.

I think the US is the only English-speaking country in the world that has "modernized" its spelling system, somewhat.

[lenz]

What about spelling in Canada, Australia, NZ? Do they have their own local mixtures of spelling or do they keep to AE (Canada?) resp. BE (Aus, NZ?)?

In Canada, British spelling is taught in schools but "correct" grammar and spoken English is a mixture of American and British with Canadian regional peculiarities thrown in.

[Raphael Lambach]

I always wondered if American editions of British books apply the American spelling regulations to the text, or vice-versa? I assume they leave the text as it is, right?

I always joke my English teacher, because I'm learning the American English although I prefer Briths accent. However, I think Amer english is easier to understand than brit english. With Portuguese happens the same: in Portugual you can easily realize the accent of words in relation with brrazilian portuguese. About that exists a funny story: Saramago doesn't allow any of his book be translated brazilian portuguese.

For example:
You're seeing
Portugal: voc? estar a ver
Brazil: voc? est? vendo

In Brazil the word bicha means gay. In Portugal it means line. (But bicha is an offensive word to talk about or call a gay man).