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Thread: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

  1. #201
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Isahoinp View Post
    They scoffed at and shot down Tolkien, who essentially created modern fantasy. So yes, I believe it was a fair assumption to make.
    This is not a reply to my question...
    And talking "assumption", is this an assumption? :

    "Ishiguro is not Nobel material and after a 10 year gap in works he released a novel that borders on being fantasy and now nothing since. For me to even consider him a realistic candidate I'd need to have him release more works."
    Deus ex machina

  2. #202

    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by tiganeasca View Post
    I have followed this thread and its predecessor with interest but I must confess that the interest has been slowly decreasing. And so I have been thinking about why that might be. I've read many of the authors discussed here and have also been very happy to discover new ones or ones I knew little about to add to my "wanted" lists. But as I ponder, I keep wondering why there is such clear and absolute fascination with an award made by a very small circle of people? Why the insistent gazing at tea leaves, not to say navel-gazing?

    At the end of the day, it's just another award. Or perhaps even the "pre-eminent" award for "serious literature" (whatever that may be). But given the award's notoriously uneven history, why do we care so much? (I include myself because I always pay attention, though I can't work myself up to the level of fascination displayed by most in this thread). Is it because it has such a significant effect on the publishing markets, on our own reading, or is it simply for the fun of it?

    I will confess when LeClezio won a number of years ago now, I had only vaguely heard of him. So I duly investigated and discovered an author whose aesthetic, whose writing, whose tone and attitude I found remarkably attractive. A lovely discovery. But in the end, I keep returning to the idea that this is still just another award made by the very small number of people with their own predilections, tastes, and agendas.... I guess I feel a little "odd man out" and so I ask you all, what am I missing? Why is all the speculation so fascinating?

    I think you might be underestimating the value of community as well. It's a lonely business being a fan of literature that often demands a lot from its readers. Reading is a solo enterprise, but in the forum it's possible to share a passion that otherwise often exists only in the space between an individual and the pages.

  3. #203

    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Ater, Lividus, Ruber, & V View Post
    leopold, why not Danius? I don't think she's given one yet. Engdahl did Naipaul, Jelinek, Pamuk, and Le Clézio, and Englund did Munro.
    It's just my feelings of course. By this moment she follows the pattern of Englund, not Engdal. During last two years she didn't laudatio, but made very detailed introduction to Nobel lecture. On other hand, Wastberg was dominated figure in the respect of these ceremony speeches during last 13 years. And most part of his "victims" were novelists with interest for big time etc. As I can see, general system is this one: in most cases this speech make secretary of SA or chairman of committee, sometimes it's member of SA who was most active supporter of laureate(?).

  4. #204

    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    You're probably right about the last sentence. I was surprised Göran didn't make the speech for Mo Yan. Guessing that had to do with people criticizing the choice with how much he'd gain from sales.

    Also... a little sad. https://www.svt.se/kultur/bok/ishigu...till-stockholm

  5. #205
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by faulkner View Post
    I think you might be underestimating the value of community as well. It's a lonely business being a fan of literature that often demands a lot from its readers. Reading is a solo enterprise, but in the forum it's possible to share a passion that otherwise often exists only in the space between an individual and the pages.
    Well said. I work at a university and, even there, it's not like I have a plethora of folks with whom to talk books.

  6. #206

    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    JCamilo, I have no doubt that the Latin American writers enjoyed much fame in Europe and the United States. It's why I mentioned the rest of the world outside of Europe as places where their impact would be limited.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluszczokrzew View Post
    With certainty, I can only speak about Poland. I guess that it was similar in Czechoslovakia and USSR, but probably the popularity came later.


    The boom came in the 60ties, culminated in the 70ties and never faded entirely. All the publishing houses in Poland were state-owned and strictly controlled, so (for sure) there was a political decision to translate numerous authors from Latin America. Maybe it was a part of larger politics - countries from the soviet bloc were strengthening relations with South America to counterbalance the influence of the USA. Anyway, it was a huge success. Magical realism was entirely different from whatever you could find in Poland at that time. But on the other hands, Latin American societies were in many aspects similar to ours. Semi-peripheral countries, in the shadow of the superpower, struggling with poverty, authoritarian rule, catholic tradition. For some, these books were windows to the exotic world behind the iron curtain. There was even a dedicated publishing series: Proza iberoamerykańska, where more than a hundred titles were published (see here: http://lubimyczytac.pl/seria/62/proz...c=data-wydania). Even today, writers from Latin America are very popular and their books often become bestsellers.


    Some notable Polish writers, esp. Olga Tokarczuk and Paweł Huelle, are strongly influenced by Latin American literature, and their prose is sometimes called "Polish magical realism".
    Thank you for the historical context! This is all very intriguing to me. Yes, I'm beginning to see the cultural connections.

  7. #207
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Septularisen View Post
    This is not a reply to my question...
    And talking "assumption", is this an assumption? :

    "Ishiguro is not Nobel material and after a 10 year gap in works he released a novel that borders on being fantasy and now nothing since. For me to even consider him a realistic candidate I'd need to have him release more works."
    I don't get your point here. I speculated on the Nobel prize and how it would chosen by the Academy in a thread titled Nobel Prize in Literature 2017 Speculation. That was the entire point of the thread. I stand by that statement. I did not consider him a serious candidate. Clearly this opinion was widely held by others considering his name didn't even appear on the Ladbrokes betting odds. Nobody was betting on him to win it. Congrats, you've pointed out that a candidate won the prize that I said I didn't believe would win it. Great detective work, Sherlock.

  8. #208
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Uemarasan View Post
    Unfortunately, we will have to disagree at this point. I've qualified my statements enough by saying that people who have read a lot of literature would know who Vargas Llosa is. These are the same people who follow the Nobel Prize and have an idea of who the perennial candidates are. The general reader wouldn't know any of these things (including previous winners) unless they see a sticker on a book. Only Garcia Marquez from that group comes close to the level of fame of Ishiguro.

    Again, my words have been taken out of context. The reference to a postcolonial literature elective is with regard to my area of the world. It is not meant to be an all-encompassing statement.
    This entire argument is absurd. MVL was hugely famous throughout the world and well known before winning the prize. Nearly every review of his work be it in general, widely-read newspapers in the Western world or actual literary reviews would discuss him as a potential Nobel winner. He was the most famous author of the Latin Boom after Garcia Marquez. For fuck's sake, he was a presidential candidate even. Harold Bloom included his works in the Western Literary Canon. Your country specifically not knowing him or newspapers saying they didn't know him doesn't make him "little-known" or whatever you're trying to imply.

    Not being the most absolute, #1, famous writer from an entire continent (arguably Garcia Marquez) doesn't mean that he wasn't known.

  9. #209
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by tiganeasca View Post
    I have followed this thread and its predecessor with interest but I must confess that the interest has been slowly decreasing. And so I have been thinking about why that might be. I've read many of the authors discussed here and have also been very happy to discover new ones or ones I knew little about to add to my "wanted" lists. But as I ponder, I keep wondering why there is such clear and absolute fascination with an award made by a very small circle of people? Why the insistent gazing at tea leaves, not to say navel-gazing?

    At the end of the day, it's just another award. Or perhaps even the "pre-eminent" award for "serious literature" (whatever that may be). But given the award's notoriously uneven history, why do we care so much? (I include myself because I always pay attention, though I can't work myself up to the level of fascination displayed by most in this thread). Is it because it has such a significant effect on the publishing markets, on our own reading, or is it simply for the fun of it?
    It's the oldest literary prize of its type in existence. Nearly every other international literary prize was specifically created as a sort of copy of it (some of these other prizes outright state this). The expertise, nominating process, and judging are far more detailed and analyzed than other literary prizes. The expertise and selection process are lengthier and more wholesome than most if not all other prizes. It is also one of the richest literary prizes in existence.

    The prize itself helps set the stage for "what is literature? Who is writing literature?" Simply by bestowing this prize the Swedish Academy can alter what people widely consider serious literature to be. This can have lasting effects on world literature. Sure, there may be "misses" or "uneven" wins in the past, but at that specific point in time there were serious reasons for the candidate winning.

    For those of who like to speculate, it can reveal us to new writers. The awarding of the prize can confirm our previous held beliefs or refute them. It can show us how little we know, how much more we have to read or learn.

  10. #210
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Uemarasan View Post
    JCamilo, I have no doubt that the Latin American writers enjoyed much fame in Europe and the United States. It's why I mentioned the rest of the world outside of Europe as places where their impact would be limited.
    Well, not flogging the dead horse any longer. I guess we more or less agree here. In a way, hyspanic latin-american (and spanish) is not an unusal place where the europeans look for good literature. Its not like they picked Brazil and portuguese, but indeed Llosa was picked when he was more or less in decline, which may not be the same for Ishiguro.

  11. #211

    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Isahoinp View Post
    This entire argument is absurd. MVL was hugely famous throughout the world and well known before winning the prize. Nearly every review of his work be it in general, widely-read newspapers in the Western world or actual literary reviews would discuss him as a potential Nobel winner. He was the most famous author of the Latin Boom after Garcia Marquez. For fuck's sake, he was a presidential candidate even. Harold Bloom included his works in the Western Literary Canon. Your country specifically not knowing him or newspapers saying they didn't know him doesn't make him "little-known" or whatever you're trying to imply.

    Not being the most absolute, #1, famous writer from an entire continent (arguably Garcia Marquez) doesn't mean that he wasn't known.
    I've replied to this extensively and I like to let dead horses lie peacefully. Please read more carefully and thoroughly next time. Look up the word "qualifier" in the dictionary. Stop making me repeat myself. And let me just say this: I do not live in the West and Western culture is not the center of my universe. Neither is it for many people.

    If you have more to say, kindly PM me instead. Any further flogging will only further derail this thread.

  12. #212
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Um so on that note, what do people think of Ishiguro's work?

  13. #213

    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by redheadshadz View Post
    Um so on that note, what do people think of Ishiguro's work?

    I think if there's another laureate he's closely related to it might be J. M. Coetzee. Both seem to value precision over all else. I think Coetzee's accomplishments at the moment are more substantial, but I also think Ishiguro takes greater risks in his work. And has, sometimes, made great work out of those adventures. Should also be noted that I believe Coetzee only had ten books out at Ishiguro's age (so not a substantial number higher than Kazuo's eight).

  14. #214

    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    https://www.japantimes.co.jp/culture...-prize-winner/

    "The Nobel winner revealed on Thursday he is in discussions to continue harnessing his Japanese roots in a perhaps unexpected way: by writing a graphic novel.“This is a new thing for me and reconnects me to my Japanese childhood of reading manga,” he said."

    Did anyone read my article above wherein Danius was shocked and thrilled when he spoke with her over the phone and explained he would accept the award in Stockholm unlike Dylan? lol

  15. #215
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by faulkner View Post
    I think you might be underestimating the value of community as well. It's a lonely business being a fan of literature that often demands a lot from its readers. Reading is a solo enterprise, but in the forum it's possible to share a passion that otherwise often exists only in the space between an individual and the pages.
    I liked your words, you've got the point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stevie B
    Well said. I work at a university and, even there, it's not like I have a plethora of folks with whom to talk books.
    Neither do I, and I work in your environment. Most of the time people usually ask: "Why do you care about that stuff?". So I ask them why they're so crazy about their favorite team, rock band or TV series (and whatever is related with that "stuff"). It's just passion. If you don't feel it, you can't understand it.

  16. #216
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Ater, Lividus, Ruber, & V View Post
    Did anyone read my article above wherein Danius was shocked and thrilled when he spoke with her over the phone and explained he would accept the award in Stockholm unlike Dylan? lol
    Lol, I would have done it...if only I could read swedish.

    Actually I'd like to ask you the swedish formula Sara Danius used to say: "The Nobel Prize in Literature for 2017 is awarded to...".
    Is it "Nobelpriset i Litteratur 2017 tilldelas..." correct?

  17. #217
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by Ater, Lividus, Ruber, & V View Post
    https://www.japantimes.co.jp/culture...-prize-winner/

    "The Nobel winner revealed on Thursday he is in discussions to continue harnessing his Japanese roots in a perhaps unexpected way: by writing a graphic novel.“This is a new thing for me and reconnects me to my Japanese childhood of reading manga,” he said."

    Did anyone read my article above wherein Danius was shocked and thrilled when he spoke with her over the phone and explained he would accept the award in Stockholm unlike Dylan? lol
    Huh, interesting. He also said he was writing a novel on Thursday, wonder if he meant this or he has another book in the works.

    And lol, just went back and saw that article...c'mon Danius, it was just one laureate who didn't do that

  18. #218

    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Maybe he has two! Be odd considering his productivity, but who knows.

    Dante:

    http://www.svenskaakademien.se/press...eratur-ar-2017

    "Nobelpriset i litteratur ĺr 2017 tilldelas den engelske författaren Kazuo Ishiguro"

    The Nobel Prize in literature for 2017 is awarded to the English author Kazuo Ishiguro.

    EDIT: Sounds like they awarded him in a time of great productivity

    "Ishiguro, who is currently “very deep” into writing his latest novel, which he is juggling alongside film, theatre and graphic novel projects,"

    https://www.theguardian.com/books/2017/oct/05/kazuo-ishiguro-wins-the-nobel-prize-in-literature
    Last edited by Ater, Lividus, Ruber, & V; 08-Oct-2017 at 03:13.

  19. #219
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    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Quote Originally Posted by faulkner View Post
    I think you might be underestimating the value of community as well. It's a lonely business being a fan of literature that often demands a lot from its readers. Reading is a solo enterprise, but in the forum it's possible to share a passion that otherwise often exists only in the space between an individual and the pages.
    Yes, this too. I don't know anyone in real life as into literature as people are on here. Even English professors at my old college, outside of their respective areas, weren't so interested in world literature as what I see here.

    Also, ALRV, that's great news. Hopefully this novel doesn't take him another 10 years/hopefully he can get his other works out soon.

  20. #220

    Default Re: Nobel Prize in Literature 2017

    Agreed. Professors I know tend to focus on their specific areas (which makes sense when they have to know EVERYTHING) and aren't that into discussing contemporary authors from around the world with much avidity. Here, a different story.

    OTM! I found the rest of that window interview you wanted. You'll have to skip around, but it looks to be the entirety here.

    https://www.svtplay.se/video/1547292...turpristagaren

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