Nobel Prize in Literature 2020 Speculation

Status
Not open for further replies.

redhead

Blahblahblah
While I could certainly see Charles Simic or Louise Gluck winning I'm starting to wonder if the large number of works they both have out could just be due to some sort of academic or student writing a paper comparing the two. It seems a bit odd to me that after passing up John Ashbury and awarding Bob Dylan that the Academy would suddenly be looking for another American poet.

Yeah, without the library I wouldn’t have thought either were in contention. It could be due to research (Rachel Cusk had some books in her trilogy out last year and I think something like that was happening), but the number of books checked out for both makes me think this is different. It could also be that another English language poet is in serious contention (Carson?) and they want to evaluate her against similar writers who might be out of contention if she won.
 

Bartleby

Moderator
While I could certainly see Charles Simic or Louise Gluck winning I'm starting to wonder if the large number of works they both have out could just be due to some sort of academic or student writing a paper comparing the two. It seems a bit odd to me that after passing up John Ashbury and awarding Bob Dylan that the Academy would suddenly be looking for another American poet.
Maybe Per Wästberg, member of the Thomas Tranströmer prize, which awarded awarded Glück earlier this year, also was considering Simic? And the titles still remain as checked out? Could be a possibility, who knows...
 

Liam

Administrator
No, it would indeed spoil the fun! However it could also be used as a ruse--checking out all of the available works from certain writers who (the members know) are definitely NOT going to win this particular year, ? (<-- however, that would be giving the SA too much credit, I think).
 
D

Deleted member 83959

Guest
I went through the entire Library. Literally every single entry in it. This is everyone with a decent number of works in the library that had 4 or more works checked out.

Ann Carson

Javier Marias

Marilynne Robinson

David Grossman

Jon Fosse

Homero Aridjis - 6

Charles Simic

Louise Gluck

Annie Ernaux - 6

Can Xue - 7

Yu Hua - 6

Yan Lianke - 4

Michel Houellebecq - 9

Rosa Liksom - 5

Hilary Mantel - 6

Friederike Mayrocker - 12

Peter Nadas - 6

Marie Norin - 6

Botho Strauß - 9

Ingela Strandberg - 6

Jan Erik Vold - 6

Xi Xi - 6

Yu Hua - 6
 
Last edited by a moderator:

garzuit

Former Member
Mexican here. Forget abour Aridjis. He's not Cervantes or Nobel worthy. He wrote his best poetry in his 20's, which I admire tremendously, but then he was too involved with environmental activism, public service, or something happened that his poetry took a turn for the worse. His latest novels sound like deleted episodes from the Narcos series.
 

redhead

Blahblahblah
I went through the entire Library. Literally every single entry in it. This is everyone with a decent number of works in the library that had 4 or more works checked out.

That’s awesome you went through it all. I’ve thought of doing it before but stopped in the C’s.

edit: Some unfamiliar names on that list. Has anyone on here read anything by Botho Strauß, Ingela Strandberg, Marie Norin, or Jan Erik Vold?
 
Last edited:
D

Deleted member 83959

Guest
That’s awesome you went through it all. I’ve thought of doing it before but stopped in the C’s.

edit: Some unfamiliar names on that list. Has anyone on here read anything by Botho Strauß, Ingela Strandberg, Marie Norin, or Jan Erik Vold?

I always assumed if another dramatist were to win it would be Jon Fosse or Tom Stoppard. Stoppard definitely isn’t happening based on the Library (they haven’t been purchasing his recent works). Botho Strauß seems like he could be an option. He’s won numerous prizes that past German language laureates have won.

Xi Xi won the most recent Newman Prize. So it’s fairly easy to see the academics that awarded that prize nominating her. Given how hot Hong Kong is politically her win would make sense.

Jan Erik Vold is a proponent of a sort of musical poetry. I wouldn’t really say he’s a “songwriter” like Dylan but he does perform his lyrical poetry to backing music. If that’s the case his win could be similar to Dylan’s in that the Academy awarding poets who aren’t strictly speaking “normal.” He’s also reworked past Dylan works and recorded translations of them to music. He’s released numerous musical recordings and has collaborated with Chet Baker and Bill Frisell (the most widely known jazz musicians he’s collaborated with).

Ingela Strandberg has won two previous awards the Academy gives. So she’s been vetted by them before. To me it seems more likely that the Academy is considering her for one of the open two members seats.

I’ve never heard of Marie Norin either. From a surface level background search I’d have trouble saying she’s “big” enough to win the Nobel. Like with Strandberg I think it’s more likely she’s being considered for one of the open member seats.
 

Stevie B

Current Member
Has anyone on here read anything by Botho Strauß, Ingela Strandberg, Marie Norin, or Jan Erik Vold?

I don't put a lot of faith in customer reviews, but years ago, when I was thinking about reading Botho Strauss, I noticed his book ratings on Goodreads were uniformly low. That was enough for me to decide to give his work a pass at that moment.
 

redhead

Blahblahblah
Thanks for the write up, Isa. They look like an interesting bunch of writers. Although I agree that those Scandinavian writers might not actually be in contention. It might be them on the look out for new members, or maybe for some of the Scandinavian-centric prizes they give out.

I don't put a lot of faith in customer reviews, but years ago, when I was thinking about reading Botho Strauss, I noticed his book ratings on Goodreads were uniformly low. That was enough for me to decide to give his work a pass at that moment.

I don’t put much stock in those either, but I just checked his Goodreads and I’m a bit shocked at the average ratings some of his books have. I took a look at his Wikipedia page, and most of his translated works have “reception” sections. Here’s a few quotes on some of his collections and plays:

“The critic wrote that some of the stories "include unsettling surreal touches", but that most of them "are heavier-than-air fantasies that tend to revolve around the usual postmodern problems of alienated intellectuals, cultural collisions and consumer dystopias". "Ultimately", the critic wrote, "this is less a novel of ideas, or even of characters, than a series of grandiloquent speeches and freakish dream sequences".”

“ The critic wrote that some of the passages are so "undilutedly alienated they read almost as parody-German intellectualism at its most grim", while others "are truly haunting, reminding readers that postmodernism can translate as historical and emotional homelessness".”

"The spare abstract quality of Strauss's language is the reflection of his subject: the isolation of the self/artist in a world where no one really listens. While some readers will prefer the more richly furnished world of a novelist like V.S. Naipaul, this book by Botho Strauss is like a sculpture by Giacometti—clean, pared-down, and without a shred of unnecessary flesh."

“ John Simon reviewed the play in New York in 1979, when it was first performed in the United States: "The stultifying banality of the play is matched only by its arrogance—it is, for example, written in a pointless free verse that becomes even flatter in Anne Cattaneo's translation. The only thing big about Big and Little is its pretentiousness; everything else, except its length, is little."[2] Mel Gussow of The New York Times described the play in 1983 as "a nonlinear but consequential tour of present-day alienation". He called it "theoretically tantalizing, more interesting to contemplate than to experience and less adventurous than works by Mr. Strauss's peers such as Peter Handke and Franz Xaver Kroetz".”



I can easily see why he might be so lauded by German critics while others are more lukewarm. That said, I was kind of intrigued by the divisiveness of his work, and I usually make a point each speculation season to read some new authors and, due to COVID, I haven’t been able to do much of that so far this year. So I bought the only thing available in English on the Kindle, a collection of three of his plays. I’m curious to see how he is.
 

redhead

Blahblahblah
Here's an interesting piece about Strauß, albeit in German:

It's written by a fan (well, arguably more of a former fan). Apparently, last year Handke said something to the effect that Strauß would have been a worthy winner, and the author uses this as an excuse to examine Strauß's work. He says that although Strauß's reputation has waned since the 80's, back then both he and Handke were regarded as "heavyweights." At the time, the author preferred Strauß to Handke--it sounds like he's never been Handke's biggest fan, although he can appreciate Handke's evolution and work even if he himself doesn't get much out of it. Strauß, however, has remained too static in his eyes. He mostly continues on with the same exact themes in the same forms he used before, and his few attempts at something else, something great, have come across as muddled. And his two most recent books are bad enough that not awarding Strauß was probably the right decision in the writer’s eyes. It's just one person's opinion, but I think it's a pretty interesting read (note: my German is god awful, so if I misunderstood anything, please let me know).

It's noteworthy to see that someone who was apparently in competition with Handke at one point might still be under consideration (or could there be another reason he has books out? Like Can Xue, I doubt he has a huge following in Stockholm). And if he does win, well, The Buried Giant received a mixed reception, only for Danius to list it as one of her favorites from Ishiguro's body of work.
 
Last edited:

redhead

Blahblahblah
Sorry to triple post, but, well, it's been almost a week since my last post here. Anyway, I finished a collection of plays by Botho Strauß, and I actually really liked it. There were two shorter ones that really impressed me. There wasn't much of a narrative there; both were more like a collection of tragicomic scenes revolving around similar themes, mostly alienation and consumer culture. In a way, they kind of reminded me of the films by Roy Andersson. I decided to check out some of his other work on the strength of them, although those haven't arrived yet.

The third play in the collection, The Park, is a reimagining of Shakespeare's A Midsummer Night's Dream set in 80's Germany. As such, it has an actual story. However, it didn't work quite as well for me. The characters were purposefully flat, the plot seemed less interested in retelling Shakespeare than in exploring alienation from contemporary culture, and there were some racially charged elements that both aged and crossed the Atlantic poorly.

Since I posted a bunch of quotes from reviews above, I figured I might as well do the same here, from a critic quoted on Wikipedia who had a more favorable impression: "Paul Taylor of The Independent reviewed a 1995 production in London, and wrote that "the malaise of these contemporary characters is altogether more existential than anything suffered in the Dream, an inwardly-turned madness rather than the healthier lunacy of love". He described how "thematic motifs from the Shakespeare surface in a provocatively warped way" and called the play "a work in which the spirit of Shakespeare's comedy leaks stirringly (if, in the end, impotently) into the senses of the contemporary personnel", summarizing it as "a strangely haunting experience"."

I highly doubt he'll win this year right after Handke, but after both him and Dylan, I'm hesitant to definitively say a certain writer won't win.
 
Last edited:

Bartleby

Moderator
found by chance this gem of a short podcast with then (2011) permanent secretary Peter Englund in which he says:

“I think the same thing goes about the sort of now we must have a woman or we must have someone from Africa. We honestly try to avoid it. I think it would be disastrous for the prize and it would really be disastrous for the one who got the prize If they got the sense that I received it not because of what I write but because of who I am.”

agreed.

He’s also adamant that the writers chosen are expected to represent nothing or no one but themselves, their writing; so they’re not chosen because of political situations in their country, something they suffered from their government, something personal they’ve said etc. He gives the example of Müller; she’s not representing women, nor Germany, nor anything else other than herself.


please, listen to it! It’s 7 minutes of pure GOLD!!!
(I’d like to transcribe it all really, but it’d be too exhaustive a task)
 
Last edited:
Yes, here's the list, finally:

Surprised she hasn't thrown any writer from North America (United States or Canada), so no Margaret ATWOOD, Aki SHIMAZAKI, Richard FORD or Cormac McCARTHY…

Some others names seems missing :
Northern Africa & Middle East – Amin MAALOUF , Tahar BEN JELLOUN, Yasmina KHADRA, Nuruddin FARAH, Abdellatif LAÂBI…
Europe – Volker BRAUN, Ludmila OULITSKAÏA, Salman RUSHDIE, Elif SHAFAK, Norman MANEA, Karl Ove KNAUSGAARD, Hanif KUREISHI, François CHENG, Hans-Magnus ENZENSBERGER …
Asia & the Indo-Subcontinent – Haruki MURAKAMI, Lianke YAN…
South America & Latin America; with the Caribbean – Carlos LISCANO, Horacio CASTELLANOS-MOYA…

But okay, I can understand that she choose, writers that she loves!
 

Bartleby

Moderator
Surprised she hasn't thrown any writer from North America (United States or Canada), so no Margaret ATWOOD, Aki SHIMAZAKI, Richard FORD or Cormac McCARTHY…

Some others names seems missing :
Northern Africa & Middle East – Amin MAALOUF , Tahar BEN JELLOUN, Yasmina KHADRA, Nuruddin FARAH, Abdellatif LAÂBI…
Europe – Volker BRAUN, Ludmila OULITSKAÏA, Salman RUSHDIE, Elif SHAFAK, Norman MANEA, Karl Ove KNAUSGAARD, Hanif KUREISHI, François CHENG, Hans-Magnus ENZENSBERGER …
Asia & the Indo-Subcontinent – Haruki MURAKAMI, Lianke YAN…
South America & Latin America; with the Caribbean – Carlos LISCANO, Horacio CASTELLANOS-MOYA…

But okay, I can understand that she choose, writers that she loves!
She says she likes not to focus on English writing authors for they receive too much attention already, something like that.
 

nagisa

Spiky member
found by chance this gem of a short podcast with then (2011) permanent secretary Peter Englund in which he says:

“I think the same thing goes about the sort of now we must have a woman or we must have someone from Africa. We honestly try to avoid it. I think it would be disastrous for the prize and it would really be disastrous for the one who got the prize If they got the sense that I received it not because of what I write but because of who I am.”

agreed.

He’s also adamant that the writers chosen are expected to represent nothing or no one but themselves, their writing; so they’re not chosen because of political situations in their country, something they suffered from their government, something personal they’ve said etc. He gives the example of Müller; she’s not representing women, nor Germany, nor anything else other than herself.


please, listen to it! It’s 7 minutes of pure GOLD!!!
(I’d like to transcribe it all really, but it’d be too exhaustive a task)

He does concede that there should be better representation, but that there shouldn't be the sense that authors get the prize for who they are. But why do some of us get the sense then that the current rewarded authors are getting it for who they are: authors that cater to and are easily accessible to the Swedish Academy? By refusing to entertain the notion that maybe the current situation isn't satisfactory enough, it makes itself an institution that parochialises itself and does not do justice to its professed, global mission.

I agree that avoiding the appearance of party political bias (left/right) is good, though.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top