Favorite Films

[Patrick Murtha]

Here is an interesting, kind of sad piece on Klute screenwriter Andy Lewis:

https://classictvhistory.wordpress.com/2018/04/06/obituary-andy-lewis-1925-2018/

And here is an interview with him:

https://trustory.fm/blog/a-qa-with-klute-co-writer-andy-lewis/

One gets a vivid picture of “development hell” from these. I have a screenwriter friend and he would confirm.

The longer version of the Klute script that Lewis describes sounds much more “novelistic”, and one might wish that he had adapted it INTO a novel. Also that his unproduced screenplays, which sound interesting, were available to read.

 

[Stevie B]

Here is an interesting, kind of sad piece on Klute screenwriter Andy Lewis:

Sad, indeed, especially as a fellow Bay Stater (though I'm from the part of the state where people actually pronounce "R's"). By the way, since you always have interesting little anecdotes to share, here's one of my own. My friend Rick, as a recent college grad, taught acting classes for a summer during the Williamstown Theater Festival season. Many of his students were the children of celebrities in various shows. I recall him sharing that one of his students was the son of Donald Sutherland. Little did we know back then that little Kiefer would eventually become an even bigger name in Hollywood.

 

[Patrick Murtha]

^ That is very cool! Donald is a master actor in my opinion. Ordinary People, Invasion of the Body Snatchers, Don’t Look Now, 1900, Six Degrees of Separation, his single scene in JFK - one could go on and on.

 

[Stevie B]

^ That is very cool! Donald is a master actor in my opinion. Ordinary People, Invasion of the Body Snatchers, Don’t Look Now, 1900, Six Degrees of Separation, his single scene in JFK - one could go on and on.

I forgot there were so many good ones. I think younger film watchers might know him best for The Hunger Games. As far as Ordinary People is concerned, Mary Tyler Moore's performance is what I recall the most. She was a beast!

 

[Patrick Murtha]

I think that Ordinary People is one of the best acted films ever made - Hutton, Sutherland, Moore, Hirsch. You can tell that it was directed BY an actor (Redford).

Jennifer Lawrence has repeatedly spoken of Sutherland as an acting mentor, and a reading one, too - he sent her a box of books including Anna Karenina.

 

[Patrick Murtha]

LOVE your lists, guys!!

Marcel Carne (I think) is the one who made Children of Paradise; I agree, a brilliant film!

Eric Rohmer is vastly underrated, I've seen so many of his films and love them all,

Children of Paradise is an extraordinary theatrical novelistic HUNK of a film. I think that many people who would love it have not seen it!

 

[Patrick Murtha]

Rather than list my favorite films in general, because really I haven’t got a year, I’ll share a list I made at Twitter when asked my favorite critically panned movies that I love - films maudits, I sometimes call them. This is not comprehensive but suggestive:

Skidoo, Bitter Moon, One from the Heart, Exorcist II: The Heretic, HealtH, Cruising, From the Life of the Marionettes, Rich and Strange, A Perfect Couple, Gerry, Timecode, My Blueberry Nights, Secret Ceremony, Ryan’s Daughter, Zabriskie Point, Texas Killing Fields, There’s Always Vanilla, U Turn, -30-, The Baby of Mâcon, Four Friends, Body Snatchers, Belly, Quintet, Halloween (Rob Zombie), Body Double, Prêt-à-Porter, Summer of Sam, Stardust Memories

 

[Stevie B]

Rather than list my favorite films in general, because really I haven’t got a year, I’ll share a list I made at Twitter when asked my favorite critically panned movies that I love - films maudits, I sometimes call them. This is not comprehensive but suggestive:

Skidoo, Bitter Moon, One from the Heart, Exorcist II: The Heretic, HealtH, Cruising, From the Life of the Marionettes, Rich and Strange, A Perfect Couple, Gerry, Timecode, My Blueberry Nights, Secret Ceremony, Ryan’s Daughter, Zabriskie Point, Texas Killing Fields, There’s Always Vanilla, U Turn, -30-, The Baby of Mâcon, Four Friends, Body Snatchers, Belly, Quintet, Halloween (Rob Zombie), Body Double, Prêt-à-Porter, Summer of Sam

I'm surprised "Cruising" made your list. I can't recall if I've ever watched the film in its entirety, but I never understood why the fisting scene in the bar was included. On the other hand, I've also heard people say the controversial film doesn't deserve its homophobic reputation. Any thoughts?

 

[Patrick Murtha]

Definite thoughts. I've watched the film with a group of gay friends. None of us found it offensive or homophobic. On the contrary, atmospheric and gripping.

I know the leather scene from the inside. Cruising is pretty damned authentic, as it well should be given that it was filmed at actual bars with real leathermen. Importantly, Friedkin also captures the erotic heat and the edginess. It thrilled me to see a “mainstream” film get the feeling of the milieu.

The fisting scene? That was part of that capture. I’ve seen “worse” in person. Dave Thomas’s SCTV parody of it is hilarious:

 

[Ben Jackson]

I think that Ordinary People is one of the best acted films ever made - Hutton, Sutherland, Moore, Hirsch. You can tell that it was directed BY an actor (Redford).

Jennifer Lawrence has repeatedly spoken of Sutherland as an acting mentor, and a reading one, too - he sent her a box of books including Anna Karenina.

Ordinary People is one of the most underrated movies that ever won Best Picture Oscar (I might also add Chariots of Fire in the mix). In as much as the movie isn't better than Raging Bull, it's a very beautiful movie. Deserving Oscars for Tyler Moore deserved her Oscars, and even Hutton and Sutherland did very well.

 

[Patrick Murtha]

^ Raging Bull is at the same time both super-impressive and not my favorite Scorsese. It has a touch of the cold exercise about it.

But I have a funny relation to Scorsese. I haven’t really loved anything of his since Goodfellas - 30 years! I think he became prey to gigantism, and over-dependent on DiCaprio. Gangs of New York in particular I think is just a TERRIBLE film, as bad as I’ve seen from a major director, with Day-Lewis overacting shamelessly (as he did in There Will Be Blood, also).

I like all of Scorsese’s early films up to and including New York, New York, and also The King of Comedy and After Hours from the Eighties.

 

[Americanreader]

Ordinary People is one of the most underrated movies that ever won Best Picture Oscar (I might also add Chariots of Fire in the mix). In as much as the movie isn't better than Raging Bull, it's a very beautiful movie. Deserving Oscars for Tyler Moore deserved her Oscars, and even Hutton and Sutherland did very well.

I agree. That movie is so good. The Mary Tyler Moore Show is my favorite TV show, and Moore on that show vs Ordinary People is like two different actresses, really brilliant casting and a great show of her range.

 

[Stevie B]

The King of Comedy

"Better to be king for a night than a schmuck for a lifetime."

 

[Patrick Murtha]

^ The casting of De Niro in Joker was of course a reference to The King of Comedy.

 

[Stevie B]

Definite thoughts. I've watched the film with a group of gay friends. None of us found it offensive or homophobic. On the contrary, atmospheric and gripping.

I know the leather scene from the inside. Cruising is pretty damned authentic, as it well should be given that it was filmed at actual bars with real leathermen. Importantly, Friedkin also captures the erotic heat and the edginess. It thrilled me to see a “mainstream” film get the feeling of the milieu.

The fisting scene? That was part of that capture. I’ve seen “worse” in person. Dave Thomas’s SCTV parody of it is hilarious:

I recall the initial uproar and suggestions of homophobia and exploitation. Good to know the film has aged well and is worth another look.

William Friedkin's 'Cruising' Doesn't Deserve Its Homophobic Reputation

William Friedkin’s subversive thriller is an indictment of the homophobic status quo that was unfairly judged before it even hit theaters.

collider.com

 

[Patrick Murtha]

I agree. That movie is so good. The Mary Tyler Moore Show is my favorite TV show, and Moore on that show vs Ordinary People is like two different actresses, really brilliant casting and a great show of her range.

Moore is on the record as being intensely grateful to Redford for believing she could do it. She has also said that she saw her character as a victim of her upbringing, not an inherently bad person.

 

[Stevie B]

^ The casting of De Niro in Joker was of course a reference to The King of Comedy.

Rupert Pupkin and Jake LaMotta. Not too many actors could have pulled off playing both characters so well.

 

[Patrick Murtha]

I recall the initial uproar and suggestions of homophobia and exploitation. Good to know the film has aged well and is worth another look.

William Friedkin's 'Cruising' Doesn't Deserve Its Homophobic Reputation

William Friedkin’s subversive thriller is an indictment of the homophobic status quo that was unfairly judged before it even hit theaters.

collider.com

Yes, I have seen that piece! The reaction of “gay activists” during the making and release of Cruising was, I think it is fair to say, an early example of an attempt at “cancel culture”, and therefore one reason I never got on board with that kind of activism. Their take was knee-jerk and simply wrong, in my estimation, but it was an article of faith for many, for years after that.

I applauded the gay critic Robin Wood, who stood up for the film (and whose independent takes on other “problematic” movies such as Cimino’s The Deer Hunter and Heaven’s Gate were always worth considering).

Am I a contrarian? Sometimes perhaps a little. Whenever I see people ganging up on something (and getting off on that ganging up), I do tend to gravitate to the other side. This goes a long way towards explaining my general “anti-woke” feeling, as detailed in other posts. I hate simplistic takes.

 

[Ben Jackson]

^ Raging Bull is at the same time both super-impressive and not my favorite Scorsese. It has a touch of the cold exercise about it.

But I have a funny relation to Scorsese. I haven’t really loved anything of his since Goodfellas - 30 years! I think he became prey to gigantism, and over-dependent on DiCaprio. Gangs of New York in particular I think is just a TERRIBLE film, as bad as I’ve seen from a major director, with Day-Lewis overacting shamelessly (as he did in There Will Be Blood, also).

I like all of Scorsese’s early films up to and including New York, New York, and also The King of Comedy and After Hours from the Eighties.

For Scorsese, I have seen about 15 movies of his. I can confidently say that his movies I've loved are Raging Bull, Goodfellas, Taxi Driver, Wolf of Wall Street, The Departed. I don't really love The Aviator, though I consider it a better movie than Gangs of New York and Casino. The Irishman too is another good movie, not brilliant. As you rightly said, Pat, I think he's over-depending on Di Caprio, the way he became over-dependent on De Niro in twenty-five, thirty years ago. I haven't seen movies like Silence, The Mission, Mean Street, Hugo, Cape Fear so I can't judge. I heard he has a new movie coming staring Di Caprio.

 

[Patrick Murtha]

^ Yes, Marty has a thing for “male muses”. I think the results of that diminish after a while. And as I have said elsewhere, I wish he would work small occasionally, to recharge the batteries. He came out of that low budget indie world. I would take his first feature Who’s That Knocking at My Door, which few people have seen, over most of his recent work.