Swedish Literature
- Thread starter Stewart
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waalkwriter
Reader
Yes indeed, careless mistakes. Any other fans of Brett Eaton Ellis here?
Anyway, sowieso, Eric would Stieg Larsson be the best to with?
Better yet, I will give a short list of the ones I am most seriously considering, Growth of the Soil by Knut Hamsun, or Natives of Hemso by August Strindberg. Of course Hamsun is technically Norwegian he is still a Scandinavian writer, I may read them both eventually.
Seems to me that Scandinavia had a lot of talent in this time period, was going through a golden period, sort of like the U.S. would be between the 20s and 50s, Germany as well. Strindberg and Ibsen were both unfairly denied Nobels for Literature and yet still its been said Scandinavia was overrepresented in the early awards, not many at all I count, the only seemingly unworthy winner seems to be Selma Lagerlof, who appears to have contributed very little as a far as career in literature goes, and Karlfeldt, whom the Nobel broke its own rules to give a posthumous award to. I think the disastrous 1974 incident has most to do with it, that and all the major Swedish authors are on the committee, lol.
Anyway, sowieso, Eric would Stieg Larsson be the best to with?
Better yet, I will give a short list of the ones I am most seriously considering, Growth of the Soil by Knut Hamsun, or Natives of Hemso by August Strindberg. Of course Hamsun is technically Norwegian he is still a Scandinavian writer, I may read them both eventually.
Seems to me that Scandinavia had a lot of talent in this time period, was going through a golden period, sort of like the U.S. would be between the 20s and 50s, Germany as well. Strindberg and Ibsen were both unfairly denied Nobels for Literature and yet still its been said Scandinavia was overrepresented in the early awards, not many at all I count, the only seemingly unworthy winner seems to be Selma Lagerlof, who appears to have contributed very little as a far as career in literature goes, and Karlfeldt, whom the Nobel broke its own rules to give a posthumous award to. I think the disastrous 1974 incident has most to do with it, that and all the major Swedish authors are on the committee, lol.
Bjorn
Reader
OK, them's fighting words, and I can only assume you're deliberately trying to goad me into answering your question.
Well, it worked. I know she's no longer widely sold in Dan Brown's home country, but the idea that Selma Lagerl?f - one of the most widely-read and widely-translated Swedish-language authors, consistently in print 70 years after her death, one of the greatest stylists of Swedish literature - didn't have a career in literature is simply patently false. Do yourself a favour and search out Jerusalem or The Emperor of Portugalia and then get back to me.A few other all-time favourites off the top of my head that you should be able to find in translation:
Hjalmar S?derberg - Doktor Glas
Frans G Bengtsson - The Long Ships
Torgny Lindgren - The Way Of A Serpent
Majgull Axelsson - April Witch
Vilhelm Moberg - The Emigrants
And probably not in print in English right now but still great:
Carl Jonas Love Almqvist - The Queen's Diadem
Eyvind Johnson - Return To Ithaca
PS. Yes, I love Bret Easton Ellis. And Stieg Larsson is, from what I gather, about as useful as an intro to Swedish literature as, say, Clive Cussler is as an intro to US lit.
Daniel del Real
Moderator
Nice to know!
Now a new doubt comes out. There are a few po-mo writers in this list. I thought you hated everything about this movement
miercuri
Reader
I really want to order Stieg Larsson, but in paperback and the third one is already out of print on thebookdepository. I could get them in Romanian but they're a tad more expensive and I would prefer a Swedish to English translation since they are so much closer linguistically.
Out of Bjorn's list I only read Doktor Glass. I knew absolutely nothing about it and was very impressed, a bit later I found out it was considered a classic of Swedish literature.
I have a book by Torngy Lindgren, though not the one that Bjorn lists.
The Swedes are alright I guess I would gladly read some more, I'll look up the recommendations in this thread.
Out of Bjorn's list I only read Doktor Glass. I knew absolutely nothing about it and was very impressed, a bit later I found out it was considered a classic of Swedish literature.
I have a book by Torngy Lindgren, though not the one that Bjorn lists.
The Swedes are alright I guess
I would gladly read some more, I'll look up the recommendations in this thread.
waalkwriter
Reader
If you consider Eco and Saramago po-mo writers yes.Nice to know!
Now a new doubt comes out. There are a few po-mo writers in this list. I thought you hated everything about this movement
waalkwriter
Reader
OK, them's fighting words, and I can only assume you're deliberately trying to goad me into answering your question.
A few other all-time favourites off the top of my head that you should be able to find in translation:
Hjalmar S?derberg - Doktor Glas
Frans G Bengtsson - The Long Ships
Torgny Lindgren - The Way Of A Serpent
Majgull Axelsson - April Witch
Vilhelm Moberg - The Emigrants
And probably not in print in English right now but still great:
Carl Jonas Love Almqvist - The Queen's Diadem
Eyvind Johnson - Return To Ithaca
PS. Yes, I love Bret Easton Ellis. And Stieg Larsson is, from what I gather, about as useful as an intro to Swedish literature as, say, Clive Cussler is as an intro to US lit.
I apologize, the only information I saw on the english wikipedia article was the following:
Obviously I was not impressed. I see no Strindberg books, not a fan,Selma Ottilia Lovisa Lagerl?f (Swedish pronunciation: [ˈsɛlma ʊˈtiːlɪa lʊˈviːsa ˈlɑːɡərˌl?ːv] (listen); 20 November 1858?16 March 1940) was a Swedish author. She was the first female writer to win the Nobel Prize in Literature, and most widely known for her children's book Nils Holgerssons underbara resa genom Sverige (The Wonderful Adventures of Nils).
miercuri
Reader
What about Eggers? He's so po-mo that they've placed him in the hysterical-realist boat.
Bjorn
Reader
And Ellis?What about Eggers? He's so po-mo that they've placed him in the hysterical-realist boat.
I'm not a huge Strindberg fan, no, but Natives of Hems? is probably my favourite of his, so by all means: it's an excellent novel.
Waalkwriter perhaps doesn't know the works of Selma Lagerl?f. As Bj?rn suggests, she has been a much-read and much-loved author down the years - and widely translated into umpteen languages. I haven't read much myself, but I think Waalkwriter is in danger of being too dismissive of her.
I also hope that more contemporary Swedish literature gets translated into English - and not only crime novels. Unlike Bj?rn, I am a Strindberg fan. His fairy-tales, his late plays, etc. I'm only just discovering his satirical prose, and he could be pretty nasty when he didn't like someone. But we mustn't get too bogged down in the Strindberg-S?derberg marsh. Swedish literature is, to be tautological, a literature, a national one, not only five writers who keep getting retranslated.
Sadly, this is what seems to happen to the Swedish-literature-in-English-translation canon. This canon consists of people from long ago, some Nobel prizewinners, plus a few contemporary crime authors. The mould has to be broken before English-speaking readers can realise that Swedish literature is bigger than those few authors we know from translations, however great some of them may be, such as Lagerkvist.
And concerning contemporary authors, for instance Alexander Ahndoril is quite a big name in Sweden. Nonetheless, it hasn't been his fantasy novels that have appeared in English so far, but his "faction" rendering of the life and marriages of Ingmar Bergman. So the Ahndoril book has maybe been translated not because of Ahndoril's own writing, but more because it is about a world-famous film director, and the name "Bergman" sells books.
By the way, Knut Hamsun was not "technically Norwegian" in the same was as Oscar Wilde was not "technically Irish". There always lurks the danger of lumping together Scandinavian literature as one gloom-laden literature from the far snowy wastes of the North. It's similar to lumping together Australian, Canadian, South African, Scottish, Irish, English, Welsh, Jamaican, etc., authors who all write in English, and then creating a mystical entity called "English Literature" out of them. They may all write in the same language, but their experiences and sensibilities can vary a lot.
I also hope that more contemporary Swedish literature gets translated into English - and not only crime novels. Unlike Bj?rn, I am a Strindberg fan. His fairy-tales, his late plays, etc. I'm only just discovering his satirical prose, and he could be pretty nasty when he didn't like someone. But we mustn't get too bogged down in the Strindberg-S?derberg marsh. Swedish literature is, to be tautological, a literature, a national one, not only five writers who keep getting retranslated.
Sadly, this is what seems to happen to the Swedish-literature-in-English-translation canon. This canon consists of people from long ago, some Nobel prizewinners, plus a few contemporary crime authors. The mould has to be broken before English-speaking readers can realise that Swedish literature is bigger than those few authors we know from translations, however great some of them may be, such as Lagerkvist.
And concerning contemporary authors, for instance Alexander Ahndoril is quite a big name in Sweden. Nonetheless, it hasn't been his fantasy novels that have appeared in English so far, but his "faction" rendering of the life and marriages of Ingmar Bergman. So the Ahndoril book has maybe been translated not because of Ahndoril's own writing, but more because it is about a world-famous film director, and the name "Bergman" sells books.
By the way, Knut Hamsun was not "technically Norwegian" in the same was as Oscar Wilde was not "technically Irish". There always lurks the danger of lumping together Scandinavian literature as one gloom-laden literature from the far snowy wastes of the North. It's similar to lumping together Australian, Canadian, South African, Scottish, Irish, English, Welsh, Jamaican, etc., authors who all write in English, and then creating a mystical entity called "English Literature" out of them. They may all write in the same language, but their experiences and sensibilities can vary a lot.
waalkwriter
Reader
All these interesting comments aside, the Wondrous Adventures of Nils does look like a children book I would interesting to read.
And I don't really find Eggers a post-modernist, I think he is part of the new generation of American authors that transcends that petty term. Eggers is just a good writer who writes about interesting things, in fact I find more his has more in common with modernists in his realism and clarity than post-modernists, the same Ellis.
Again I apologize about Lagerlof, English Wikipedia listed her as being primarily famous on the back of a single children's novel so I took that at face value.
Can anyone explain to me how Karlfeldt got the Nobel? It's against the rules of the prize to give it posthumously, (something that got noted to some ignorant Newsweeks writers suggesting that John Updike of all people get a posthumous Nobel).
And I don't really find Eggers a post-modernist, I think he is part of the new generation of American authors that transcends that petty term. Eggers is just a good writer who writes about interesting things, in fact I find more his has more in common with modernists in his realism and clarity than post-modernists, the same Ellis.
Again I apologize about Lagerlof, English Wikipedia listed her as being primarily famous on the back of a single children's novel so I took that at face value.
Can anyone explain to me how Karlfeldt got the Nobel? It's against the rules of the prize to give it posthumously, (something that got noted to some ignorant Newsweeks writers suggesting that John Updike of all people get a posthumous Nobel).
Bjorn
Reader
waalkwriter
Reader
Ah thanks. I wonder why she was only noted in English for that Children's book. I thought it was a J.M. Barrie type deal.
Daniel del Real
Moderator
It seems that Karlfeldt had been previously assigned as the winner of that year before his death. Thus the Nobel Academy decided to stick with their decision and give it posthumously.
I don't know if things have changed lately, for example, if the Academy decided in early September the winner and he/she dies days before the announcement, would they still give it to this writer?
Liam
Administrator
Depends on who's doing the lumping.
There's nothing "mystical" about the so-called entity of English Literature unless you're engaged in reading the Revelations of Julian of Norwich.
English Literature qualifies as literature written in English, regardless of where the original author is from.
So? Experiences and sensibilities can vary a lot between authors from the same time period from the same country: compare Dickens to de Quincey or Edgar Allan Poe to James Fenimore Cooper.
I agree that there is such a thing as a "national" literature, but ultimately it all boils down to language. Jonathan Littell might be Jewish-American living in Spain, but right now he's contributing to the overstuffed body of the French belles-lettres. Being fluent in English will not help you with your reading of The Kindly Ones unless you tackle it in translation (provided you wish to read it at all).
Bjorn
Reader
waalkwriter
Reader
Danke. Es is mehr klar, aber Ich wuerde das einen Amerikaner konnen das Preis gewonnen.
I hate to see what any actual German speakers might think of that ^^
I hate to see what any actual German speakers might think of that ^^
Never mind Germans, what about the KGB? While we're going on and on about the Stasi on other threads, one dodgy chappie from neutral Sweden has been forgotten: Jan Guillou. Although he is Swedish (N.B. this is a thread about Swedish literature - and he wrote thrillers), he may rank among all those dodgy GDR suspects who then turn out to have worked for The Other Side. Swedes are a bit na?ve when it comes to trouble in their midst. So if you want to read spy thrillers by someone who knew things from the inside, read Guillou. Pity he was batting for the wrong side, so to speak. Bj?rn, you can read this:
Jan Guillou arbetade f?r KGB | Inrikes | SvD
Julian of Norwich: who was he?
Lagerl?f: I feel like translating a story by her.
As for posthumous prizes and the Nobel, they have enough living dead on their committee, perhaps, not to need the real thing. If you are appointed for life you cannot, sadly, guarantee that you will be up to the job up to the moment of your last chrism. Except Ekman and Gyllensten who jumped ship.
Jan Guillou arbetade f?r KGB | Inrikes | SvD
Julian of Norwich: who was he?
Lagerl?f: I feel like translating a story by her.
As for posthumous prizes and the Nobel, they have enough living dead on their committee, perhaps, not to need the real thing. If you are appointed for life you cannot, sadly, guarantee that you will be up to the job up to the moment of your last chrism. Except Ekman and Gyllensten who jumped ship.
I've just read it, and it's a bit of a non-story, although no doubt Expressen will try to make something out of it. He wasn't exactly the Soviet Union's master spy in Sweden. A bit like G?nter Grass's so-called SS past, although he doesn't seem to have been personally responsible for any ethnic cleansing.
Harry
Not such a non-story. Obviously, S?po, the Swedish equivalent of secret policing, must have known for yonks. But Yarn Guillou is worshipped in some circles as the greatest thriller-writer since bugged loaves. Maybe this will knock some of the shine off the medal. After the Norwegian naughty boy Arne Treholt and a few other chappies in the 1980s got caught, plus H?rsfj?rden, this is yet more proof that the Swedes can house funny bunnies. Bring back Svea loyalists like the Untermensch-sterilisers Alva and Gunnar Myrdal, and their Maoist son Jan, that's what I say. Sweden should be a broad church.